have you registered a cobra in NSW?

[Zedn]

Hi all,

If you have registered a cobra in NSW in the last 10 years, can you please send me a PM.

We are trying to collect some historic data. I will respond to the PM with more details.

Cheers.

[Zedn]

For those that want to email.

cobraicv@gmail.com

Really appreciate any responses i get.

[Zedn]

Perhaps i was too cryptic because i have only had one response.

We are compiling factual historical data on cobra registration what kit you registered when and what testing you had to do.

Im not after extensive information, just a few basic facts that you will probably know off the top of your head.

Appreciate any help.

[Merv and Sharon]

Good idea and good luck Liam.

[400TT]

Liam, just make it clear that you will not capture or pass on any personal information, registration, VIN numbers. Anything to identify the persons or vehicles you are collecting the data from? It is a purely anonymous submission. I assume that is what you are doing.

[Zedn]

Of course. If people wish to remain anonymous that is fine. Im not after VINs and they dont need to give me their names.

Purely just after facts, not emotion or hearsay.

[BJ's Snake]

Originally Posted by Zedn

Perhaps i was too cryptic because i have only had one response.

We are compiling factual historical data on cobra registration what kit you registered when and what testing you had to do.

Im not after extensive information, just a few basic facts that you will probably know off the top of your head.

Appreciate any help.

Who are WE.... .Times have changed fella and I can't see your reasoning for this except to stir more crap with the RTA that you and your mate have already started plus it is none of your business.
Happy Easter

Brett

[Zedn]

Originally Posted by BJ's Snake

Who are WE.... .Times have changed fella and I can't see your reasoning for this except to stir more crap with the RTA that you and your mate have already started plus it is none of your business.
Happy Easter

Brett

Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion.

We are some ICV builders who would like to get our cars registered.

[Merv and Sharon]

Coming from QLD, I just can't fully grasp the fear that the RTA seems to have induced among some owners in NSW. Builders are of course in a different situation. Reform of the RTA is obviously long overdue, as noted in another thread.

[suthol]

G'day All,

As a bit of an introduction I'm one of the admins over on Ozclubbies and a member of the Clubman drivers club of Australia and have a completed Lotus 7 replica that I am having difficulties getting registered in NSW due to the Light Vehicle Safety section of the RTA instructing the engineering inspection department on items that they now want dynamically tested.

The instructions include, all ICVs to be brake tested, beam & torsion tested, seat mounts and seat belt anchor points to be dynamically tested and an ADR 10-02 compliant steering column, this is irrespective of what compliance data you kit manufacturer may give you.

The seat mount and seat belt tests will set you back around $6 - $8K, they are tested together as described in the ADR and will definitely damage your seats and also compromise the strength of all of the mounts points.

Dan Leavy the GM of Vehicle Safety is driving this and despite saying he doesn't want destructive testing he won't accept " your " engineers learned opinion or accept FEA.

The inspection engineers are up in arms but their hands are tied from above.

Dan Leavy, our current speedhump is not an automotive engineer rather he came from Workcover and was a crane inspector.

The clubman fraternity is strong and we have or are in the process of putting working parties together to work with the RTA and their interstate buddies to try to come to a more satisfactory arrangement.

Our group has already been in touch with the ombudsman who in turn instructed the RTA to talk to us and has asked us to respond back to him if we are not satisfied.


What zedn is trying to do here is gather from the Cobra Club a table of issues and the dates that these issues arose so that we can build a table and timeline that shows the moving goal posts.

Whether you guys choose to come along for the ride is neither here or there but we would really prefer to have a cross section of all types of ICV and not just clubman's to further reinforce to both the executive management of the RTA and the ombudsman that the regime is totally out of control.

I have also approached Shannon's to get some data on how many ICVs they have insured and how many have been involved in claims since 2000 so that we can clearly illustrate that ICV owners & builders are not hoons and that we take a lot of pride in what we have achieved.

Over to you.

Regards
Dave King
Suthol VII

[beauies]

Thanks Suthol for becoming a member and visiting this site instead of me visiting yours on a daily basis.

Would really like to help the fight but not sure how as i am new on the ICV scene.
If i can help let me know
cheers Brad

[Zedn]

Thanks Suthol and welcome to the forum.

Guys Suthols car is engineered by a very good engineer and still having trouble with registration. This is not just a case of the RTA not liking an engineer like some have suggested in the past.

We are just trying to work to a solution that sees everyone be able to continue to enjoy the hobby in the future. Who knows, there are probably a lot of you who probably want to build other cars also.

If you want to help us out and provide data, that is great. But if you dont then we totally respect that.

[suthol]

Thanks for the welcome Brad and zedn, my engineer is one that was apparently highly recommended by the Cobra Club but like almost every engineer in NSW won't be doing any more ICVs.

I'll add a bit on the ADR 10-02 compliant column, this reg is the same as UNCE 12-3 which requires the column to be able to collapse directly away from a body strike and the wheel to collapse at an angle for a head strike. We have found that Caterham in the UK make such a wheel boss that is tested with a Momo so the package could be OK but the wheel is too small by the ADR and the RTA want a full ADR 10-02 compliant column end to end anyway.

Here's the rub, ADR 10 although updated from time to time has been replaced by ADR 69-00 which defines crash protection using an air bag. ADR 10-02 is dated June 2010 and ADR 69-00 is dated October 2007, every car in Oz has a drivers airbag even the most humble POS out of China or India.

Apparently there are cars with ADR 69-00 compliant columns that are also ADR 10-02 compliant, I believe the Mazda MX-5 NC is one.

My car is ADR 10-01 compliant and I have been driving it on the road on a UVP since August 2009, not acceptable so unless there is change at the top and common sense I have to totally re-engineer the steering setup.

I'll stay out of it now and drop in from time to time for a look to see what sort of discussion has developed.

regards
Dave King
Suthol VII

[OZCOBRA]

Originally Posted by BJ's Snake

Who are WE.... .Times have changed fella and I can't see your reasoning for this except to stir more crap with the RTA that you and your mate have already started plus it is none of your business.
Happy Easter

Brett

BJ you selfish KNOB!!!...Liam was just to polite to say it!!!!

Damn right times have changed.....But I guess it doesn't matter to you, that others may want to enjoy the same privileges you presently have with your Car!!!

Originally Posted by Zedn

Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion.

We are some ICV builders who would like to get our cars registered.

Liam,
All I can say is good on you for making the effort and giving your time in SUPPORT of the future Cobra builds.

I'd also not be to concerned with the slow response especially leading into and over the Easter break!!!

WELCOME to you as well Dave,good having an informed source assisting those involved!!!

Good WORK mate!!

OZ...

[Merv and Sharon]

Ditto OZ, and thanks for the new information Dave.

I built my car a couple of years ago, but I am pleased to see some attempt at organised support for some reasonable regulations, across ICV categories. I do feel for the guys trying to build Cobras, especially in NSW. While we are really great at providing support for builders, the discussion that you raise above has been a 'no-go' area on this Forum for a while. Let's hope that situation changes so guys like Liam and Baz can build and register their cars.

[Baz]

Welcome to our Forum Dave. As you can see by some of the comments posted here, there is that 'Don't Make Waves Group' that is quite vocal within this Forum, but fortunately they are of the minority who have been fortunate enough to have their had cars registered for a number of years under a completely different system than we are currently experiencing.

Opinions expressed here are quite fragmented, unlike those expressed on the Ozclubbies Forum where the vast majority appear to be supportive and cohesive.

Liam is doing a great job and the verbal support shown by Merv, Beuies etc is what drives us towards our final goal. Thanks also for your support Ozcobra. Your's is a voice that we can really do with.

For those of you who belong to the 'Don't Make Waves Group', all I ask is that you try practising a thing called empathy. Place yourselves in our position and then be critical of our actions in trying all avenues to get our VIN Nos. from the RTA.

Dave, I sent you that information which you were after via your personal email. Let me know that you received it.

Baz

[sjelby]

Keep up the good work Liam.
The rules should be the same for all states and territories, thats why they call them AUSTRALIAN design rules.
Not STATE design rules.
Stan.

[Merv and Sharon]

Thanks again Liam. Please do keep us informed as new documents and regulatory examples become available. Without co-ordinated action, these issues will affect us in all States within the next two years, and new Cobras, or even cars officially modified after registration will become fewer, I believe.

Many of us remain ready to help, if directed.

[suthol]

Thanks Baz, info received.

It may come as a surprise to some that the reason we now enjoy ADR 37-01 in NSW is because a Victorian Clubman kit manufacturer ( Arrow / Westfield )took the RTA on via the ombudsman and won.

Regards
Dave King
Suthol VII

[Rob. Smith]

I've told it before and I'll tell the story again...A hot rod boy built a car and it crashed. His missus lost the unborn child so he sued the engineer. The engineer sued the RTA and they bore the costs. That's the abbreviated version and that's the soul reason for the RTA being tough....they don't have any idea as how to get around this issue. So they make all "different" rego applications impossible. They have made engineers take out multi million dollar insurance policies to cover their own arse. so the engineers just leave.
Funny...local councils just change the legislation to avoid people from suing over tripping on crook footpaths. Simply now you can't sue !