Shelby CSX price increase!

[Excaliber]

Enzo died,,, they still call 'em Ferrari's.

...laws and regulations have changed and that is the only thing keeping turnkey Shelby Cobras from rolling off an assembly line.

Well all the replica manufacturers have that problem, or perhaps we would see a rather large number of manufacturers offering completed cars! Excalibur used too, Aurora, Auto Kraft, all met the same fate, Federal laws.

That term replica (and replicar) appears very often on the SPF company website in reference to their car, no shame, nor should there be! A "license" add's credibility and in theory "value" to any given product. A licensed product does not have to be the original product built by the same people, place or business as the original. It is not and never will be an "authentic" anything other than a licensed product.

China bought the brand name "Schwinn". They market a number of products under that name, including mopeds. Having owned/operated a moped sales and service shop I know that moped well. It's built with the same parts virtually ALL Chinese mopeds are built with. It's no more or less reliable than any other typical Chinese moped, but it sure SELLS for a premium price! Looks better too, deeper shine on the plastic, painted wheels, "replica" Honda 50 cc motor. The motors on Chinese bikes are actually pretty darn good, it's much more likely the wheels WILL FALL OFF before the motor goes out.

Is it still a Schwinn? Yeah, legally, not that I'd recommend anyone buy one, get a cheap Chinese moped instead, same thing, less money...

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Enzo died,,, they still call 'em Ferrari's.



That term replica (and replicar) appears very often on the SPF company website in reference to their car, no shame, nor should there be! A "license" add's credibility and in theory "value" to any given product. A licensed product does not have to be the original product built by the same people, place or business as the original. It is not and never will be an "authentic" anything other than a licensed product.

Ford died and they still call them Fords, too.


You beat me to this:

"The GT40 continuation is built to exacting standards - in fact over two thirds of the rolling chassis's parts are interchangeable with that of an original car, including the 'monocoque" style chassis.

"

If people want to change the language - continuation, roller, kit, and others - then take it up with the industry.

Oh, here we go again, again... Can't we find another religious issue to talk about? What color should a Cobra be? for example?

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

Oh, here we go again, again... Can't we find another religious issue to talk about? What color should a Cobra be? for example?

BLUE - they should all be BLUE.

That way my red one can stand out

[Excaliber]

Well thats exactly what I'm doing, taking it up with the manufacturer(s).

"Not a kit", is another term that's starting to bug me. If it's not a "kit" (and I maintain that is EXACTLY what it is, ALL of them, including Shelbys) and it's not a "replica" then what the heck is the public supposed to think it is?

Then I have to spend 30 mintues at the next car show explaining this all to somebody who is trying to figure it out. Where the guy next to me is claiming his Shelby is "genuine", the guy next to him is explaining it's "not a kit", and the next guy is going on about it being an officially licensed Shelby. Oh wait, theres a guy with a "real" alloy body Cobra! Dang, we can't even agree among ourselves who the heck is on first! It's damaging to the hobby and it engenders disgust among the populace. To often those WITH a clue, blow off the whole scene because of the mass confusion.

The industry would do well to consider some alternatives instead of this dog eat dog approach. Let the product speak for itself.

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

To often those WITH a clue, blow off the whole scene because of the mass confusion.

Not Confusing at all.
Mine will be a "Genuine" "Original" Kirkham...


This intellectual masturbation needs to be put to bed.


Enjoy your day.

[Excaliber]

Interesting post A-Snake. "Component car", a fitting term, not misleading and reasonably accurate. It could be applied to a number of replicas. Note that Shelby's, in this article, correctly state the car is also a replica, as we have come to understand the meaning of the word.

Like all other replica's if you were to use the strict definition of the word, a Shelby CSX glass series car would not qualify, nor would any glass replica. A few alloy body Shelbys are contenders, most being based on the Kirkham. Certainly the McCluskey examples (notably the Completition series cars), would qualify. Some of the early Kirkham's would also come close, or be spot on, to a strict definition of the word, "replica".

Due to popular demand for more modern parts and ever changing specs, few Kirkhams today, as well as Shelbys, even come close to a strict definition of the word replica. But in either case, they do retain the basic "components" that would allow for an extremely accurate build should that be desired.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Like all other replica's if you were to use the strict definition of the word, a Shelby CSX glass series car would not qualify, nor would any glass replica. A few alloy body Shelbys are contenders, most being based on the Kirkham. Certainly the McCluskey examples (notably the Completition series cars), would qualify. Some of the early Kirkham's would also come close, or be spot on, to a strict definition of the word, "replica".

OK, I'll disagree on this one. The aluminum bodied Kirkham and Kirkham-built CSX cars would belong in the same category as the glass-bodied cars because of the manufacturing process (stamped aluminum). The closest to a true replica of the originals (by the definition above) would be the rolled alloy cars in the CSX1000 series. And they are beautiful.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

OK, I'll disagree on this one. The aluminum bodied Kirkham and Kirkham-built CSX cars would belong in the same category as the glass-bodied cars. The closest to a true replica of the originals (by the definition above) would be the rolled alloy cars in the CSX1000 series. And they are beautiful.

Here's one on ClubCobra for sale now:

http://www.clubcobra.com/classifieds...uct=3243&cat=2

Uh, obviously not affiliated with the seller.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Here's one on ClubCobra for sale now:

http://www.clubcobra.com/classifieds...uct=3243&cat=2

Uh, obviously not affiliated with the seller.

That is the one that I was thinking of. I saw this at Barrett Jackson exhibit area in Lance's area in September. You really need to see it in person to appreciate it.

[ACademic]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

The aluminum bodied Kirkham and Kirkham-built CSX cars would belong in the same category as the glass-bodied cars because of the manufacturing process (stamped aluminum).

Ughhhh, last time I checked out the many YouTube videos that the Kirkhams have posted on the manufacturing process at the former MIG factory in Poland, I definitely recall a bunch of guys hammering the crap out of sheet aluminum into fine art. I don't recall seeing 20 ton presses stamping out fenders, accordingly. Just for the record.

And there's still time to lock in the deal! Woohoo!

[RodKnock]

For the record, I posted that passage from the Registry, without an actual scan/photo, sometime back, and boy Evan sure took offense to it. Evan, where are you? We miss you.

Back to the thread, tomorrow, 12/1, the prices of all new CSX's increase $10,000 to $59,995. So, operators are standing by. Order early and avoid the rush.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Back to the thread, tomorrow, 12/1, the prices of all new CSX's increase $10,000 to $59,995. So, operators are standing by. Order early and avoid the rush.

Ehhh, just backdate the purchase order. We backdate stock option grants all the time.... No big deal.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Ehhh, just backdate the purchase order. We backdate stock option grants all the time.... No big deal.

Yes, but Shelby Cobras are serious business, not like stock option grants.

[Excaliber]

twobjshelby's, good catch, I'm not familiar enough with the details of a CSX1000 series car to make that call, but it would certainly be a worthy contender.

Depending on additional specs, it takes more than just a body and frame. Suspension components, dash design and gauges, interior appointments, wiring details, engine specs, etc. Suffice to say, very few cars would meet an exacting definition of the word.

Over the years there have been a few examples of other vehicle replica's that are truly breath taking in their level of detail to accuracy, but not many.

"Close enough" for most of us, usually means the body shape and contours alone is all it takes. I'm OK with that,,, just musing on a concours level of accuracy. Like when you've got 5 or 6 SAAC judges/inspectors crawling all over the car and decucting points for using the wrong bolt or nut.

[Excaliber]

The details of how the body is actually made is of less importance than the end result when it comes to an exacting definition of "replica" in my view. Stamped, some hand work, finishing touches to smooth and straighten, etc. The end result should be a body that is incredibly accurate to dimensions, shape and size, comprised of a similiar material as used on the original. For a GS Vette, that would be glass! For a Cobra, aluminum.

I'd have to deduct a few points from the CSX1000 offered by BJ for the Kirkham billet expansion tank. Which begs the question, what other departures from original specs were taken? Suspension bits? Brakes? And of course, I'd have to check it's nut's,,,, and bolt's.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

I'd have to deduct a few points from the CSX1000 offered by BJ for the Kirkham billet expansion tank. Which begs the question, what other departures from original specs were taken? Suspension bits? Brakes? And of course, I'd have to check it's nut's,,,, and bolt's.

Just to be clear, the car was not offered for sale at BJ. It was on display in the Superformance/Hillbank area but was not on the docket.

I thought the Kirkham tank was a little unorthodox too - they could have come up with one that is correct. I have one on mine too since they had one for a small block. It sure does look nice. I'm going to pull it off this winter and get the milling swirl marks buffed off.

[RodKnock]

And what about magnesium Halibrands?

[rodneym]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

And what about magnesium Halibrands?

Rodknock,
How DARE you. You're abusing the 'bash the old man's price increase' thread for your own personal endeavors..............................

Ok, ok. Brilliant idea!

[patrickt]

I think retail price maintenance is basically un-American.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by rodneym

Rodknock,
How DARE you. You're abusing the 'bash the old man's price increase' thread for your own personal endeavors..............................

Ok, ok. Brilliant idea!

Subliminal messaging.

BTW, I have an "original" coolant tank, not some "nouveau riche" Kirkham billet bling-ey coolant tank. I just can't stand them Kirkhams and all their billet bling-ey parts.

Of course, I haven't checked in a couple months, so who knows what's there now.

I think there's less than 8 hours to go until the price increase. Tic toc tic toc.