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Kirkham Motorsports

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawineer View Post
Lol, so no one is going to tell me roughly how much I'm overpaying by? If I'm getting taken to the cleaners here, I still haven't signed the paperwork. Is this i a $66k car fair market value?

I get I can lose money and it's not FDIC insured. If I wanted to ensure I'd have 77k in 3 years, I'd put it in my savings account (which, based on current interest rates, will definitely ensure it will be $77k :lol: )
Lawineer,
What spec is the 2018 BDR you are looking at? If it is a standard RT3 with a coyote motor and limited options then $77k looks high. On the other hand if the original owner had a lot of upgrades AND those upgrades are valuable to you then $77k sounds reasonable to me. These cars new have all gone up quite a lot over the past few years as well. My 2013 BDR RT3B with a Gen 1 Coyote and limited extras was $58k new -the equivalent new RT4B car today would be mid $70ís.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 05:56 PM
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The interior alone is a deal killer for some, and commands a price premium for others.

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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 06:49 PM
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The modernizing touches don't do anything for me now, at all- but 20 years ago I would have loved them (swap the wheels with Kinesis and steering wheel for Momo).

The coyote motor won't provide the visceral back-in-time retro feel most love- like my 427r with carburetor (new carb by RT drives incredibly well), but it will move the car nicely with ZERO fuss. If you don't want to wrench on the thing and want power and driveability like a modern car, you'll like the coyote.

When I had a factory five, the things I wanted were IRS (FF came with a 3 link), and manual steering (my FF had hydroboost brakes and PS).
On a tight autocross type track, you will miss your power steering, otherwise I'd much rather have the manual rack- less crap to break.

Backdraft and superformance brakes seem quite good- my FF was way over-braked up front and would lock up like crazy.

I also prefer 15" wheels now for the look despite the lack of tire choices- but I did pick up a set of 17s for track. So much more / better rubber available.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 06:57 PM
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Spent my day doing diligence on the actual car with the owner.

Wow, turns out it's a Gen I, not a Gen III like he said it was (2018 model year engine).

I'm not paying that for Gen I engine.

I kind of knew I was slightly higher (why I asked "fair" as opposed to "good") because I wanted a gen 3 (or pay more for voodoo) and loved the color and some other goodies.

I'm not paying $77k for a Gen I engine.

What about the interior commands a premium?
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Lawineer View Post

What about the interior commands a premium?
There is a place for Cobra "bling." Not everyone wants black leather with Smiths mechanical gauges and a Moto-Lita wheel. If you want bling, then you pay for it. If you don't, you don't.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 07:33 PM
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Not everyone wants a "traditional" Cobra. Like this, for instance, https://www.mecum.com/lots/FL0121-45...obra-roadster/
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawineer View Post

What about the interior commands a premium?

To some Cobra owners "originality" is part of the deal. Just like the engine, deviations from that affect price and marketability, and not usually for the better, since the number of those that want that combination are a small portion of the population.

Think of it like "spec houses". There's a reason builders paint the interiors Navajo White instead of designer colors of purple red and orange.

If those things don't matter to you and the price doesn't matter because it's in your window, buy it and enjoy it for what it is.

There are cars for sale right now on Cobra Country that are priced less and more main stream.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 01-16-2021, 09:02 PM
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Mid to high 60s seems to be the sweet spot on typical resale BDRs unless itís something really special. Most of these BDRs have low miles and a Roush /Tremec, not sure if the coyote hurts or helps. All that to say youíre probably a couple grand high, certainly within the standard deviation. A new Cobra built to spec will be 80k plus.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2021, 02:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawineer View Post
Spent my day doing diligence on the actual car with the owner.

Wow, turns out it's a Gen I, not a Gen III like he said it was (2018 model year engine).

I'm not paying that for Gen I engine.

I kind of knew I was slightly higher (why I asked "fair" as opposed to "good") because I wanted a gen 3 (or pay more for voodoo) and loved the color and some other goodies.

I'm not paying $77k for a Gen I engine.

What about the interior commands a premium?
A BDR style Cobra replica is not for everyone, the customization and deviations from original are more for those who want the basic look of a Cobra, but not "the look". As for the drivetrain hurting value, it's subjective to a point, again it depends on the buyer, but strictly from a resale value, it does. I say this as the past owner of an ERA 289 FIA Cobra with a 4.6L DOHC motor installed. The car had all the bells and whistles that ERA could offer, every single one, the first owner (great guy by the way) spent 100K having this one of a kind car customer engineered, designed, and built. He and his significant other (pre child) enjoyed the heck out of the car, as did my wife and I while we owned it. When it came time to part with it, what should have been an easy sale, ended up taking months to part with and eventually ended up overseas due to it's original titling status (a whole different conversation, do a search of the forum for the countless threads). If the car had a traditional drivetrain, it would have sold in a week or two, and for more than I eventually sold the car for. Will my next Cobra have a more traditional drivetrain, yes, yes it will, do I know what that will be yet, no, as I have yet to decide on a 427SC, 289 streetside, or 289FIA at this time. It may just end up being whatever falls in my lap at a decent price, but, and no offense, it will not be a BDR as I prefer a more traditional body, without the "modern" adaptation that dilutes the whole reason for owning a Cobra, real or replica in the first place. Just my personal choice, one which differs from yours, or one that comes from past ownership, and knowing exactly what I am looking at, not just falling in love with a color combination, or a high HP drivetrain (200hp is enough to get you killed in a Cobra, and will still get you 0-60mph in under 5 seconds)...........

I'll leave it at that.

Bill S.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2021, 07:40 AM
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Now that you decided the price was too high, my opinion was that was too high. I am reluctant to get in the middle of an already tentative deal.

Although BDR is a nice car, it has a longer than standard wheel base. If you need the room to fit in it, stay with them. If not, there are many options. Superformance, Kirkham, Shelby, ERA, would be among the higher end. FFR sells a lot of kits, perhaps the most.

A turnkey minus is much more consistent quality. The more the kit is left to the builder, the more variable the quality. Not all builders have the same attitude, skills, and pocketbook to do things right.

A member on this site is a BDR dealer, I think, and he has done a lot of Coyote builds. He goes by cashburn, I think. I suspect a lot of brands don't want to support a Coyote (where to put mounts, moving things to make it fit.
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2021, 08:01 AM
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BTW EFI can be put on any engine. If that is your reason for going Coyote, there is no need.

This is a whole new set of decisions. Throttle plate injection is an electronic fancy version of a carb. I'm not a fan. Alpha 1 strategy is a step up, maybe. Speed density is better but is under instrumented and calculated estimates of the actual air mass going into the engine. It works well for mild cams. The ultimate is mass air. That is what comes on a Coyote and most Fords since around 1989.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2021, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olddog View Post
BTW EFI can be put on any engine. If that is your reason for going Coyote, there is no need.

This is a whole new set of decisions. Throttle plate injection is an electronic fancy version of a carb. I'm not a fan. Alpha 1 strategy is a step up, maybe. Speed density is better but is under instrumented and calculated estimates of the actual air mass going into the engine. It works well for mild cams. The ultimate is mass air. That is what comes on a Coyote and most Fords since around 1989.
Agreed. I don't want a digital carburetor. That's the worst of both worlds, IMO.

Anyway, back to the drawing board to look for a new weekend car.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2021, 02:05 PM
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Give this event a look.
Texas Cobra Club Spring Meet 2021
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