Breakign down EFI options

[Ace23]

Originally Posted by philminotti

I've never heard of EFI "taming" a big cam. Certainly a cam with lots of duration and overlap can "tame" a big displacement engine with a high static compression ratio, but I don't believe EFI is going to make a radical cam any more appropriate for the street. I will say that that idle and low rpm behavior in a "hairy cam" situation is easier to manage with EFI as you really don't have to worry about fuel metering problems due to low vacuum like you would with a carb. It's been said many times on this board and I'll say it again, EFI absolutely will NOT outperform a well tuned carb at the top end. However, part throttle street manners of a well sorted EFI system can't be beat, IMO. To answer your first question, my throttle response is excellent, but that took over a thousand dollars worth of dyno time to realize.

As for sound, in a word, nonsense. EFI has no effect on sound. I can't even begin to fabricate a plausible theory why it might, so I call BS on that one.

Phil,
I should have been more clear. I guess I was referring to an EFI or more specifically a multi-port setup having an impact on a larger camshaft. Your probably right about the parking lot jabber......a LS7 sounds pretty mean with a rowdy cam and EFI. The added expense of the multi-port seem worth it just material cost looks like its $1500-$2000 difference of the self tuning setups. $1000 sounds like a pretty good bargain to have your car running as good as it can possibly be. If you think about it we are all driving 30K-90K cars and a grand at a tuner is small price to pay. I could car less if the EFI made less hp or the same at high rpm.....it would have to pay worth the trade off to have all the other benefits

Originally Posted by wkooiman

I think he's referring to independent runner systems. I switched from a single Holley to Webers on my 351C, and it definitely smoothed the engine. I had a small solid cam - slightly rough idle. With Webers, it sounded like it didn't have a performance cam at all. The lope was gone.

But it isn't EFI that does that. It's the removal of the common plenum.

BTW, I have a friend with Fast EFI and Weber style throttle bodies (TWM Induction), and another with Electromotive and TWM. They both work well, but they take a lot of work to get them running right.

Thats more like what I was referring to. I've seen comments and heard people mention that specific setups can possibly impact the sound of the car ect. I like the stack setups but just wonder how practical it would be over a multi-port.......looks like more money and I woulld think it would be much harder to locate a quality tuner. I obviously don't know much about the stack setups but thats just my guess.

Originally Posted by itstock

I had considered going the "self tuning" EFI but after talking to people who had done it and researching on the internet, it basically had me running away from them. The Fast EZ 2.0 seemed to be one of the most finicky and least reliable systems on the market. You are far better off with the multiport anyway, and there are a lot of other systems you can look at if you are interested in tuning. BigStuff3, Motec, even Holley has a decent setup. If you aren't in to tuning it, then you are going to throw a lot of money to a tuner to get it running properly, and you still run a good chance of having a temperamental setup. Also, don't forget to add in the fuel system when figuring out price of the EFI.

You might improve mpg's a bit going to a proper efi, but if your good carb is tuned and sized correctly, and the cam is right, everything else should be fine. I think once you work through your original engine woes, you will be a lot happier rather than just throwing money at problems that stemmed from something else and also add a plethora of NEW problems. When all is said and done, you are throwing $4k at an EFI/Fuel system when a portion of that money could be used to rebuild your bottom end to get the results you seek. You have a good block, you have heads, intake, and carb. All of the main ingredients are there to get roughly 500 safe, reliable, and streetable rwhp. Have the bottom end rebuilt properly and go have fun with it.

500rwhp would be pretty dang serious in one of these cars. On a dynojet would you say that would require about a 620hp crank hp? That would require some RPM in one of these stroked windsors woudn't it? I think my motor is going to check out fine.....from all the educated guesses it points to possibly the camshaft. I think it makes perfects sense to freshen it up or just go through it while its out of the car. It has a small rear main seal leak so that needs to be repaired so the the cold weather will be perfect timing. My thought process isn't that EFI would fix anything that I have going currently going on with the car. My thoughts were that it would compliment the car and its driveability if correctly installed and tuned. I would have no issue with first trying the Quick Fuel 750 I currently have on the car once the engine goes back in. Actually took the car out last night and it ran like **** below 2000rpm.....may have gotten some trash in the carb, it has a nasty consistent studder that came out of no where the last 2 times I've been in it. I've read just as many good things about the FAST sytem as I have bad. FAST is about 10 miles from my house so I would have the luxury of going to them direct and probably getting hooked up with someone that tunes on the side. Have you gotten use to that nitrous and does it make you want a big block?

Originally Posted by eschaider

Ace,

As you search for an aftermarket ECU you should take a look at the Pro-M Universal ECU. It is the Ford factory racing team ECU made for Ford to Ford's specs by the OEM that makes their Ford daily driver ECU's.

Ford had the option of going with one of the existing aftermarket offerings for the factory race cars or designing their own purpose built racing system from the ground up. They chose the fresh sheet of paper and built a very impressive system. Now the proletariat like us can have access to the same technology.

The unit comes complete with an excellent Windows based tuning software package, data logging capability and a self learning heuristic that builds your base tune so you can focus on optimizing it for your intended usage, racing or otherwise.

Here is the link => Pro-M Universal. The price is fairly easy on the budget at $2K w/o sensors. It does use many of the OEM sensors you may currently already have. You will need a MAF, and dual widebands.

Ford's FRPP business unit was originally going to sell this system over the counter through their Ford Racing Parts franchise. Something went bump in the dark and it never happened. Pro-M, which was founded by one of Fords EFI design engineers who has since passed away, worked a deal to sell the units into the aftermarket.

Very high quality, originally designed for Ford factory racing efforts, and very easy to work with.

I think you'll be impressed.


Ed

Sounds like a nice setup. We both know I just should just through a 03 terminator engine in it and a twin screw and call it day! Can you even put a mod motor in an early SPF? I thought I read where mod motors only fit in SPF cars beyone a certain build number.

Originally Posted by joyridin'

My brother has installed a few of the FAST EZ systems in the last few months and they work great. If you think you are going to bolt it on and go, that usually isn't the case though. It will take tweaks to get it running good, but the car will run and you can drive it while you tweak.

As far as comparing it to a carb, that is nuts. There is no comparison. Your car will run smoother, start easier, and be a lot less worrisome in the long run. There may be an area or two across the powerband where the carb runs better, but but across the whole powerband, it won't even be close.

Thats encouraging. I would still seek out a tuner but as you mentioned the EFI sytems that have been properly setup have to be heads and shoulders above most aspects of a carb. There are probably just as many threads about people not pleased with EFI as there are that like it.......the tuner can make or break you.