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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 11-04-2008, 01:13 PM
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Guess I'm getting the single outlet...Dan knows best!
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2008, 07:13 PM
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Another detail from the Sebring cars I'm going to copy is the early MK1 Cobra badge: it has a blue background rather than the usual white. This is the hood of CSX 2127:



I just recently found this badge available from Cobra Spares in the UK:

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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2008, 02:45 PM
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Default I may have found the shade of red...

I was talking to Chuck at Cobra Restorers about some original spec Stewart-Warner gauges, when I asked him if he knew what red AC used on the 289s, in particular CSX 2129, the red 1963 Sebring car, #98, raced by Ken Miles. He thinks that AC used British Leyland colors, rather then their own blends, and that the red was most likely Signal Red, popular on Triumphs, Jaguars and Austins. Here is a nice looking TR4A in Signal Red:



And another:



And a nice little TR2 (that someone added a TR3 front panel and grill to):



I'm going to ask Tony to work up a sample when the time comes. It reminds me of the red that the NY Giants use for the numerals on their white "away" jerseys, and the body of what they call their "alternate" jerseys, which inspired me to choose red in the first place:


Last edited by jeffy; 11-23-2008 at 04:25 PM..
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 11-28-2008, 12:44 AM
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Jeffy,

Have you found the paint code for the Signal Red yet? Looks really nice!

Thanks
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDUB View Post
Jeffy,

Have you found the paint code for the Signal Red yet? Looks really nice!

Thanks
I've found it listed under the Austin-Healey codes as I.C.I. code 6200:

http://www.coloramic.com/articles/hlyclrs.htm

http://healey.hyperboards.com/index....c&topic_id=582

I.C.I. was acquired by PPG a few years ago so, hopefully, they can produce a match.

I also found the AC Cars paint codes in another thread here, also I.C.I. codes:

AC1 Guardsman Blue 4424m Single stage urethane, c262b Base/Clear
AC2 Dark Blue fg47 single stage
AC3 Mist Silver 6182m single stage
AC4 Ruby Red 6192m single stage
AC5 Canary Yellow fg38
AC6 Lt. Green 5302m single stage, 5vf9b Base/Clear
AC8 Rosso Chiaro fg39 single stage
AC9 Pure White fg46 single stage
AC11 Mushroom 6189m single stage
AC12 Vineyard Green ej29 single stage
AC13 Live Oak 6188m single stage
AC14 Sand 6190m single stage
AC15 Princess Blue 6191m single stage

As you can see, a simple "Red" isn't listed: just "Ruby Red" and "Rosso Chiaro". My guess is that "Ruby Red" is what has sometimes been called "Svecia Red", or "Swiss" red, the color of a Swiss Army knife. This shade would have some blue in it. "Rosso Chiaro" translates into "Light Red". I'm going to research this code: it may be the AC equivalent of British Leyland Signal Red.

Older Ferraris also have a shade called "Rosso Chiaro", which looks similar to "Signal Red". Here is a 1954 500 Mondial Spyder in Ferrari Rosso Chiaro:



This may be my new favorite: gotta look up this color! Also, without any bumpers or quick jacks, the 289 bears a passing resemblance to this beast. Here is a link to more pictures:

http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z...al-Spyder.aspx

Last edited by jeffy; 11-29-2008 at 09:17 AM..
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2008, 02:35 AM
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Thanks!

Keep us posted as to what you find. It will be interesting to see what shakes out. I appreciate all of your detective work.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 12-06-2008, 09:30 AM
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For those wondering, like I was, what the functions are for the seven aircraft toggles on the Sebring car dashes, like CSX2129 in my first post, I found this dash from CSX2136, one of three Shelby competition cars referred to as the "LeMans replicas", that has the functions listed:



However, one thing that kind of gnawed at me while I have been waiting for the car to get started was my initial choice of putting some 1963 details, like the Sebring car dash, the blue background badges and kidney bean wheels, on a 1964 FIA-style body. My dilemma was that I wanted a comp car body, but didn't want an FIA-style dash with the speedo out-of-sight way off to the right, and I don't want any of the 1963 Sebring/LeMans style cars that are available from other vendors.

So, I did more research and looked up the chassis numbers for the sixteen cars built by AC and Shelby with the FIA-style body. Then, I searched the internet to see if I could find photos of the dashboards.

I discovered that some later competition cars had a more conventional dash layout, but with obvious competition upgrades. Below is the dash from CSX2557; note the unusual Jones tach with the Cobra logo on it! Good luck finding one of those!



Here is CSX2558 with a Stewart-Warner tach, which is still available; the two toggles are for the fuel pump and the cooling fan. The knob to the left of the switchplate is for the headlights, the knob on the right is for the wipers. Note that four of the small gauges are 2 5/8", but the ammeter is 2 1/16". The 1-10psi fuel gauge is no longer available, but a 1-15psi is.



Although only a true enthusiast would be aware that I was "mixing" components from different years, I decided that I would always be a little uncomfortable if my car wasn't as close to "period correct" as possible. So, I am going to use this dash layout, go back to the white Cobra badges (anyone want a pair of blue ones??) and use FIA-style wheels, even though Peter P. "loves the kidney beans"!

Also, I found a picture from the Shelby archives of a customer ordered FIA-bodied car that was originally finished in what appears to be British Signal Red (there happens to be a red MGA in the background which matches it, and MG used "Signal Red" on the MGA), so I am comfortable with that color on a comp car. Now, all I need is a chassis number!

Last edited by jeffy; 12-06-2008 at 10:01 AM..
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 12-06-2008, 10:00 AM
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BTW, for those who might be wondering if trunk dimples are needed for a "correct" FIA body, the answer is a big "NO". Only three of the five original FIA cars had dimpled trunks, and none of the subsequent FIA-style cars had dimples. And, yes, there were dimpleless FIA-style bodied cars that had the FIA-style dash with the speedo off to the right, so that combination is "correct".

Last edited by jeffy; 12-06-2008 at 10:08 AM..
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Old 12-06-2008, 10:33 AM
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One more thing. I discovered in my research the likely reason why some of the early competition cars had Bell-style sprint car steering wheels instead of the original wood-rimmed wheel. It turns out that the early cars had a worm-gear steering box, and that it wasn't unknown for the steering wheel spokes to break under heavy track use! Naturally, it would be prudent to upgrade to something stronger. After the cars switched to rack-and-pinion steering, that problem went away. Since all the FIA-style cars I've seen have the classic wood-rimmed wheel, I guess that is what I'll use, in order to be "correct", although I really like the look of the Bell wheel better.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 11:37 PM
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Wow, you are really crankin' up the history! Excellent job! I'd love to see you post the links to some of the photos, if you get a chance. Especially the red one with the MGA...

PM me on the badges...

Thanks!
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Old 12-08-2008, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffy View Post
BTW, for those who might be wondering if trunk dimples are needed for a "correct" FIA body, the answer is a big "NO". Only three of the five original FIA cars had dimpled trunks, and none of the subsequent FIA-style cars had dimples. And, yes, there were dimpleless FIA-style bodied cars that had the FIA-style dash with the speedo off to the right, so that combination is "correct".
As a matter of interest did you manage to work out which three got "dimpled"?
Ross
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Old 12-08-2008, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDUB View Post
Wow, you are really crankin' up the history! Excellent job! I'd love to see you post the links to some of the photos, if you get a chance. Especially the red one with the MGA...

Thanks!
I'll post a few links later on. The photo with the MGA I found in the book Shelby Cobra: The Shelby American Original Archives 1962-1965, on page 89. I'll try to scan it and post it.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2008, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mk2gt40 View Post
As a matter of interest did you manage to work out which three got "dimpled"?
Ross
Yes; at the 1964 Targa Florio, where the cars debuted, only CSX2323 and CSX2345 were dimpled. Later in the year, CSX2260 sprouted dimples.

Here are some screen shots from a video of the 1964 Targa Florio of CSX2301, car number 150, with a smooth trunk:





The video link is here (CSX2301 first appears at about the 20 second mark):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rRvf...eature=related
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2008, 11:19 AM
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I opted for the smooth trunk lid as I like the cleaner look. One less thing to explain other than why it's not a 427. I also opted for them not to cut the vent holes for the defroster vents.
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:18 PM
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I also opted for them not to cut the vent holes for the defroster vents.
I hadn't thought of that. Since I'm not getting the heater, or the top, I think I'll do the same. Thanks!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:21 PM
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Default dimples

there`s a nice pic of 2301 in Legates the first 40 yrs with none and on pg 116 theres 2323 smiling. Then in Schoens ferrari/ cobra on pg 214 car no. 177{2260} and pg 212 car no. 176{2345} both flashing theirs. That means 2345,2260,2323 had, and although I`ve also read only 3 got dimpled I have`nt seen 2259 dimpleless in a documented pic whilst racing in that era. anybody?
Ross
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2008, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jeffy View Post
I hadn't thought of that. Since I'm not getting the heater, or the top, I think I'll do the same. Thanks!
Jeffy, I don't know what state you are in, but some states will require the vents in order to pass inspection. Before you dismiss them, you might want to check in to that. BTW, I have both the top (along with the side curtains, in fact) and the heater with my 427. You might just find that adding that in really extends the driving season (on the other hand, if you live in Key West it doesn't matter that much ).
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2008, 03:28 PM
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Hi Patrick-

Thanks; I'll look into that inspection issue.

I'm in New York, but I just don't want to have any temptation to drive in the rain: therefore, no top and side curtains, and, without them, I doubt if the heater would do much good. Also, I assume the comp cars didn't have heaters, and you can see how anal I'm getting about being faithful to the originals...

Jeff
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Old 12-08-2008, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by jeffy View Post
Also, I assume the comp cars didn't have heaters, and you can see how anal I'm getting about being faithful to the originals...
I understand completely. One last point on the top though -- being able to put one up when you're out takes the weight off being able to "read the clouds" before you get behind the wheel. But a top is something you can always add at a later date if you so choose.
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Old 12-08-2008, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDUB View Post
I'd love to see you post the links to some of the photos, if you get a chance. Especially the red one with the MGA...

Thanks!
Here is an OK scan of that photo (note the FIA wheel on the front and kidney bean on the rear!):

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