Researching any info re: Paul Cunningham, Competition Cobra privateer

[Blackbart]

I've followed this thread with interest. I can't imagine this is the only CSX car with such a diverse "history". Thank you to all the experts out there doing their best to document these cars. I've watched what I thought was the original CSX 2049 race at Goodwood for many years. I have one question, is the Hart car(Netherlands) a knockoff of CSX 2049. If so, how can they advertise the car as 2049?

[Nedsel]

Originally Posted by Blackbart

I've followed this thread with interest. I can't imagine this is the only CSX car with such a diverse "history". Thank you to all the experts out there doing their best to document these cars. I've watched what I thought was the original CSX 2049 race at Goodwood for many years. I have one question, is the Hart car(Netherlands) a knockoff of CSX 2049. If so, how can they advertise the car as 2049?

The manager of the storage facility in which Lance stored 2049 sold the wrecked chassis remains. The front portion with the VIN intact went through several owners before the car was restored with a new chassis, after which it was sold to the Netherlands as CSX 2049. That is the car that races at Goodwood.

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by Nedsel

The manager of the storage facility in which Lance stored 2049 sold the wrecked chassis remains. The front portion with the VIN intact went through several owners before the car was restored with a new chassis, after which it was sold to the Netherlands as CSX 2049. That is the car that races at Goodwood.

So the front portion of the chassis with the VIN intact was stolen and used as the basis to construct an entirely new car without using any part of that original chassis?

And then I guess after it was realized that the front portion of the original chassis was stolen it was returned to Hasselrig who had a title to the car?

I am surprised that when the new chassis was built they did not try to use some part of the original chassis in the new chassis, like the part that had the serial number stamped in it. I am also surprised that the remains of the original chassis were not destroyed to get rid of it at the time the new chassis was made.

[1ntCobra]

Ned,

Since you have information about Hasselrig getting a loan to purchase CSX2049 do you know how much the loan was for? Or how much he paid for the car? Presumably it must have been a bargain price at the time since it was a very damaged car. I am not sure a bank would want to issue a loan for a car that seemed to be totaled, but I guess he would not have had to disclose the car's condition at the time he got the loan.

[Nedsel]

Originally Posted by 1ntCobra

Ned,

Since you have information about Hasselrig getting a loan to purchase CSX2049 do you know how much the loan was for? Or how much he paid for the car? Presumably it must have been a bargain price at the time since it was a very damaged car. I am not sure a bank would want to issue a loan for a car that seemed to be totaled, but I guess he would not have had to disclose the car's condition at the time he got the loan.

The car was financed through Haselrig's local Auto Club office. And yes, we have copies of the paperwork. He bought the wreck for $400 with payments of $50 per month.

[CompClassics]

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[Nedsel]

John, it wasn't a bank loan, but made through the local auto-club. Irregular, to be sure. We have copies of the loan payments made to Abiden, but not the payments made to the lender.

[USC_COWBOY]

Folks, now you see why I believe this is a concocted history of ownership as no one, at any time, has a complete ownership, pieces here, pieces there, traditional and regular ways and means to get to an end. In my opinion, several air-cars have been built with one in the Netherlands (Hart's car) being sold for millions and another one in Encinitas, CA being built and all of them without clear claims of ownership. Also, all this flim flam style of buying and selling done without the Cunningham ownership involvement, and shame on Shelby for not dealing with the Cunningham family before all this crap started.

This whole laughable story reminds me of how dirty money is laundered through multiple paper corporations to hide the truth. My hope and curse regarding those evil people is that they obtain their just rewards as they ultimately have their bastard creations help them meet their demise.

[Nedsel]

Originally Posted by USC_COWBOY

Folks, now you see why I believe this is a concocted history of ownership as no one, at any time, has a complete ownership, pieces here, pieces there, traditional and regular ways and means to get to an end. In my opinion, several air-cars have been built with one in the Netherlands (Hart's car) being sold for millions and another one in Encinitas, CA being built and all of them without clear claims of ownership. Also, all this flim flam style of buying and selling done without the Cunningham ownership involvement, and shame on Shelby for not dealing with the Cunningham family before all this crap started.
.

While I understand your frustration, I disagree with your conclusions. I have shared ownership documents from Ann Abiden, along with a sale to Lanse Haselrig, while you have shared your thoughts that Paul Cunningham may have owned the car, absent any documentation. While you offer the thought that you still have the remains of the Cobra, you have thus far provided only photos of a junk AC Ace chassis. I look forward to more definitive proof of Cunningham's ownership.

[CompClassics]

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[1985 CCX]

John

Are you really saying that "A Biden" had something to do with this? (possibly Joe himself?)
Now we are getting deep!
Hunter may now even own a peice of this as he seems to get around.......

Ok, kidding. True enough and I bet this is not only limited to 2049.

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by 1985 CCX

John

Are you really saying that "A Biden" had something to do with this? (possibly Joe himself?)
Now we are getting deep!
Hunter may now even own a peice of this as he seems to get around.......

Ok, kidding. True enough and I bet this is not only limited to 2049.

Jeff,

I have heard rumors that there is a gold fiberglass body car replicating a competition Cobra out there somewhere in New England. I don't think it has any ties to parts from the original car or any claims to the original title.

[1985 CCX]

Originally Posted by 1ntCobra

Jeff,

I have heard rumors that there is a gold fiberglass body car replicating a competition Cobra out there somewhere in New England. I don't think it has any ties to parts from the original car or any claims to the original title.

Yes indeed.....
It’s a replica of 2375 but in gold vs Red, fell in love with color when Wayne and I took 3021 to Amelia. There are original period parts but it’s a tribute (replica) of the real thing.
It’s fun
It stinks
It’s bad on gas
It’s got the feel if the 60’s car without the cost.
I know what it is.
So does everyone else
I am happy with it and it gets driven often.

[CompClassics]

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[CompClassics]

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[CompClassics]

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[Nedsel]

Originally Posted by CompClassics

Ned,
California has not allowed the transfer of the VIN CSX2049 to be attached to this vehicle. It is California’s belief that the frame photos in the court case were in fact the remainder of the original frame and that the car was in the process of being restored. The court case photos show a 427 Cobra frame. California has put a stipulation in place that the car is to be inspected after the restoration, before it is deemed “CSX2049”.
The only thing that California has granted is the ownership of title. It is against the law to transfer title to another vehicle. Otherwise people could buy up all the valuable titles of cars that don’t exist anymore and build cars around the title and sell them for big bucks! Good example would be to buy a Kirkham chassis and buy a title from someone that had a Cobra that was destroyed and transfer that title onto the Kirkham. California would not know the difference but would SAAC accept this as a legitimate Cobra?

If a court so decreed, SAAC would accept a reconstructed car as the only vehicle entitled to claim the VIN, but with all the caveats associated with it, especially the fact that it was not the original.

[peterpjb]

Originally Posted by CompClassics

Ned,
....
The only thing that California has granted is the ownership of title. It is against the law to transfer title to another vehicle. Otherwise people could buy up all the valuable titles of cars that don’t exist anymore and build cars around the title and sell them for big bucks! Good example would be to buy a Kirkham chassis and buy a title from someone that had a Cobra that was destroyed and transfer that title onto the Kirkham. California would not know the difference but would SAAC accept this as a legitimate Cobra?

2404 is described in the 2019 SAAC registry as a 289 Kirkham that was mated with the 2404 VIN and the original paperwork,

therefore I assume the answer is ,yes'

[CompClassics]

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[Nedsel]

Not necessarily. There are many instances of vehicles being rebuilt with new components after a wreck. In CA, you are required to have a bonded agent inspect the reconstructed vehicle to ensure the VIN on the old vehicle matches the one on the new one. And the original VIN-stamping area is supposed to be removed and destroyed.